SD GPS Module Coming this Fall

Posted By: Ed Tuesday, March 12, 2002 1:42:32 PM

Prototype Matsushita Electrics has just announced that it plans to release a GPS module that uses the SD format this fall, according to ZDnet Japan. Few details were released except that it will use chips from the U.S. company SiRF Technology. Matsushita did show of a picture of a prototype.

Matsushita's SD device will use the SiRFstarIIe/LP GPS chipset. This includes a an ARM CPU with 40 MIPS of total processing power. It is one of the lowest power GPS chipsets on the market, drawing only 60 mA in full power and 20 mA in TricklePower.

This is the first GPS device to be announced that will use the Input/Output capabilities of the SD slot, which is included on most of Palm Inc.'s models. There are already several GPS modules available that use Palm's Universal Connector.

Sony makes a similar small GPS module that uses its Memory Stick slot but it is available only in Japan.

Thanks to Eugene for the tip. -Ed

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is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 1:54:33 PM #
how much freespace does it need to have a whole state covered?

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 2:02:03 PM #
Depends on how detailed the maps are. I have the Earthmate/Solus 3.0 combo for my m505 and I can have Blue Bell, PA anywhere between 200K and 1.4MB. (no comments on town name, please )

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 2:24:42 PM #
"no comments on town name, please"

That's like putting the gun in my hand and saying, "please don't shoot me".


RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
druce @ 3/12/2002 2:36:56 PM #
Well, you could always use the Rand McNally map that comes on an SD card. Opps, I guess that that slot is already taken if you have the GPS.

Guess it is time for either Palm to support multiple cards, more memory, or Matsuhita has to shoehorn a map on their SDIO card.

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
jjsoh @ 3/12/2002 3:27:17 PM #
Hmm.. I wonder. what are the disadvantages (if any) in creating 2 SD/MMC slots in a Palm? That way you can have the map on SD and the GPS.

Or how about a pass-through slot IN the GPS unit so that another SD/MMC card can be used simultaneously? Am I ahead of myself? Eh.. most people will probably use the GPS unit stand-alone anyway. I was just throwing some ideas around.


Jim

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 4:07:35 PM #
i guess this really isnt the place for questions like this but how detailed is the road atlast expansion card? is it just interstate and main roads or does it get in to detail of even small towns?

i had the delorme street atlas (solus?) program and gps for my palm IIIx and it works ok except you can only plan a trip on the pc... if you want to later change your route (if i recall correctly)it's impossible to do on the palm. do any of the other programs allow this (assuming enough of the map has been stored on the palm)?

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 4:11:18 PM #
well if they do that it would extend the height more. what of they made an SD connector and a wire that goes to the main unit. makit it possible to use a hardcase with it. or make it extendable on the glasswindow of a car getting the best signal.

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
Beavis @ 3/12/2002 4:24:38 PM #
"Hmm.. I wonder. what are the disadvantages (if any) in creating 2 SD/MMC slots in a Palm? That way you can have the map on SD and the GPS.
Or how about a pass-through slot IN the GPS unit so that another SD/MMC card can be used simultaneously? Am I ahead of myself?"

Slow down. We're talking about Palm here. We can't expect them to come out with 2 SD slots so soon after releasing the m515 with all of its wonderfully innovative features.

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
shogun @ 3/12/2002 5:26:00 PM #
This is where the handera could come in handy. Have your maps, etc on a compact flash and run the GPS from SD/MMC slot at the same time.

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
Ed @ 3/12/2002 5:31:17 PM #
> i guess this really isnt the place for questions like this but how
> detailed is the road atlast expansion card?

You are correct but I'll cut you some slack. Here's a review of it:
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=2774

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News Editor
RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
Gadget @ 3/12/2002 6:26:51 PM #
I would really like to see a device with 24/32Mb of on board memory, and 2 SD slots.

With the number of devices planned which will use the SD slot a second makes sence. I know this means adding a additional UART, hay while they're at it they could always add 2 and incorp bluetooth!

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 11:18:07 PM #
Nooooo problem for my Handera 330, just use the 256 Mb compactflash for the GPS app _and_ maps while the SD slot does the GPS antenna.

Nan na na nah! :-)

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/13/2002 3:08:18 AM #
Why do they used the sd slot for the GPS? can they use the keyboad slot? that way we might be able to have the maps on sd cards at the same time.

RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
Ed @ 3/13/2002 9:47:59 AM #
There are several GPS modules that do use the HotSync port (what you called the keyboard port). You can read about these under "Related Information" at the end of the article. This is simply another option. Despite the drawback of taking up the SD slot, this will have at least one advantage. If Matsushita can really make their module as small as the prototype pictured above, it will be significantly smaller than its competition.

---
News Editor
RE: is 8mb internal enough on the m500 series?
Altema @ 3/13/2002 10:36:00 AM #
"Nooooo problem for my Handera 330, just use the 256 Mb compactflash for the GPS app _and_ maps while the SD slot does the GPS antenna.
Nan na na nah! :-)"

You can't do that, because I'd be jealous!

Seriously, I wish others would follow suit and have dual slots. I could probably get by with this GPS (I've got 16Mb internal RAM), but would rather have the extra slot.

palm range

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 2:27:45 PM #
what is meant by mid-range models?

isn't the m125 a low-range model? it does have an SD slot!

RE: palm range
cyruski @ 3/12/2002 2:43:09 PM #
no, it's mid range too.
however, because it doesn't have OS4.1 it doesn't support SD peripheals.

cyruski!
RE: palm range
Xian @ 3/12/2002 2:48:16 PM #
Where did you hear that one? My m505 has 4.0 and it perfectly supports my Bluetooth SDIO card.

RE: palm range
Ed @ 3/12/2002 3:03:05 PM #
> isn't the m125 a low-range model?

You are correct, it is a low-end model, if just barely. What I said was true, but not complete. I'll edit the article.

> because it doesn't have OS4.1 it doesn't support SD peripheals.

I'm sorry cyruski but you are incorrect. For proof, the m125 is listed as being compatible with the SD Bluetooth Card.


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News Editor

RE: palm range
cyruski @ 3/12/2002 4:25:46 PM #
really? oh..

i remember reading 'SDIO support' as a new thing for OS4.1. maybe in OS4.1 the SDIO support is built in, whereas we can install it on OS4 along with the drivers.

this sounds better :)

cyruski!

Additional memory, too, please

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 4:53:08 PM #
This device needs to add 16 to 32MB to be truly useful. Having a GPS without extra room to store map data is sort of pointless.

Also, the location of the SD slot on the m1xx models and especially the i705 are going to compromise constellation view.

I hope they have the smarts not to repeat one bit of history. Magellan had/has a Springboard GPS. However, its drivers hacked the serial port away from doing anything else, which sort of defeated the purpose of putting the GPS in the expansion slot to begin with.

RE: Additional memory, too, please
skytraveler @ 3/12/2002 6:32:43 PM #
If you have a Palm with 16mb of memory you can use Mapopolis (of course, you can use it with 8mb, but you won't have much room left for anything else). Their maps don't take up too much room and can be stored in the Palm's memory. I have Sacramento, Placer, Sutter, San Francisco, and Yolo in my Palm and it's only taking up about 4mb. That's not bad when you consider these maps have address information, bodies of water, and support GPS / Door-to-Door directions.

The SkyTraveler
RE: Additional memory, too, please
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 7:06:26 PM #
Don't most gps systems come with cd's that allow you to download the certain parts that you want at that time? Is this how the older palms made it work with the gps systems? If you go on a trip to a city you can simply download a new map to that city or something like that.

Sirf Tech?

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 6:09:36 PM #
Ed, are you sure the chip is from Sirf Tech?
I think they license the IP from SiRF.

Many GPS chip company license the IP from SiRF.
But they make their own chip.
I know they did that with another chip GPS.

ted

RE: Sirf Tech?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 7:25:12 PM #
I was not very clear in my sentence.
Panasonic made a GPS chip that licenses IP from
SiRF I believe.

RE: Sirf Tech?
Ed @ 3/12/2002 9:59:55 PM #
> Ed, are you sure the chip is from Sirf Tech?

The ZDnet article says it uses the SiRFstarIIe/LP. Whether SiRF will manufacture it or Matsushita, well, I don't much care.

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News Editor

ehrrrr.......

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 7:17:54 PM #
doesn't this sort of thing need driver and interface to applications?

just because it fit the socket doesn't mean it will run automagically. never mind if 8Meg mem is enough.

RE: ehrrrr.......
mikemusick @ 3/12/2002 7:27:29 PM #
Yes, you're right, although there are ways to get around it. Magellan did this with their Springboard GPS by hacking the Palm OS serial port driver, making the Palm think that it was talking to the GPS through the serial port. This way it would work with any mapping/navigation application that was looking for a conventional GPS.

I write a vertical-market GIS/nav program for Palm OS, and will expect (...hope...) that an API will be published for developers to interface directly. If they do the same thing as the Magellan I won't be particularly happy, since I need to have the serial port clear for other inputs.

RE: ehrrrr.......
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 9:19:01 PM #
Is there currently an API call for SD I/O in 4.1 for this sort of application? If not I seriously don't think Matsushita is going to take the pain doing a major OS hack just so its card can work on Palm, but than again who knows....



RE: ehrrrr.......
mikemusick @ 3/12/2002 9:52:05 PM #
No, unfortunately. There is an API "template" for hardware developers to follow, but that's about it. It was pretty clear at the presentation about SDIO at PalmSource that they (Palm) expect the people building/selling the hardware to provide a suitable driver AND have that driver resident on the card. However, given that most of the market for SDIO peripherals right now seems to be Palm OS devices, I would really be surprised if it arrived here without drivers and minimal API support.

not going to work for me

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/12/2002 10:33:06 PM #
I have a magellan sled for an old palm V and it works okay, but I was thinking of putting the whole thing on ebay and buying a sled for my 505 or possibly waiting for this sd card.

Then I rented a car last week with one of those on board GPS systems. I was ruined for ever using my palm GPS combo again. Damned thing was talking to me and showing 3D maps with arrows pointing the way. I was approaching the Mall of America and this woman's voice tells me "your destination is ahead on the left". Much higher toy factor than what I have now!

If my palm can't give me door to door, I am going to have to get a Garmin V or something similar.

RE: not going to work for me
mikemusick @ 3/12/2002 11:08:20 PM #
Then you might want to wait for Garmin's Palm OS GPS! I don't know when it's going to hit, but they've been a Palm licensee for nearly two years. There was also talk at PalmSource about something soon, but no specifics. I would expect that the Garmin-Palm will have advanced nav software built in.

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