New Treo Smartphone Images Leaked

I don't like the design. Unless you really look, it appears to be any Windows smartphone currently on the market.

Agreed. I thought the Moto Q was hideous when it was first shown but miraculously, the midlife update of it in black really helped matters.

And look how the "Black Tie" Treo 650 jazzed up a 3 year old design!

A few initial questions/observations I have on this thing:

1. It looks a lot better in black than in white. I'm very worried about the feel of that d-pad. The 755p/750/680 have a very nice d-pad. I don't want to see a return to the, ahem, "condom ring" of the Z22 & LifeDrive.

2. The "youth market" can forget about gaming on this thing with that kind of button arrangement.

3. What sort of screen resolution do they have going on for the POS version? Maybe 'm just having a bad day but that does NOT appear to be 320x320. 480x320? That does NOT look like a SSS (small square screen).

4. I think Palm's going to do major cost-cutting on this one....no IR, small DBheap/cache, perhaps even no touchscreen. If they cut it down too much it'll end up languishing on store shelves like a low-end Zire. If the touchscreen is indeed gone, then what will that do to legacy app compatibility? I could also see Verizon and Sprint heavily subsidizing this thing in order to sell more of their overpriced data plan bundles (look how VZW pushed the Q strong from day 1).

For the other specs, I predict a slow (200mhz) CPU, 64mb RAM (~48 available to the user), the Treo 755p's removable battery, a microSD slot and an improved (ie Foleo-ready) BT 1.2 stack but still without A2DP. EVDO Rev-A sounds HIGHLY suspicious at this point but anything's possible from Palm.

5. If it doesn't have a 3.5mm stereo headphone jack I will scream. This is something DEMANDED by the "youth market". If any Treo yet has a chance of a proper headphone jack it's this one. In fact, that MIGHT be this device's main selling point.

6. If I were Palm I think I'd push the GSM version of this thing super hardcore as a $250ish unlocked device. Heck, sell it to the kids as PDA/mp3 player now and in 6 months they can pop in a SIM card and begin using it as a smartphone when their funds/parents permit it!

7. The first thing I thought when I saw the grainy B&W pic of this thing a few days ago was that it might be a sliding Treo. About 9 years I had a superb Qualcomm CDMA handset that had a sliding earpiece. It was VERY comfortable and very intuitive. It'd be nifty to see a variation of the T|T slider design on a Treo. Take the basic shape of this thing but give it a 320x480 screen (smaller size than the T3/T5/TX but same resolution). Then put the d-pad & all of the app/call buttons (the silver area on this Gandolf) in the slider area. When the slider is shut you just see the QWERTY board and the screen. That'd be the easiest way to squeeze a larger screen into the Treo formfactor while keeping the keyboard and still offer some rigidity while typing. And it wouldn't look TOO iPhoneish either!

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

After waiting two years for a worthy upgrade to my Treo 650 I am beginning to think outside the box and go for the Blackberry 8830. Well...maybe I will hold on a little bit longer to see if this new Treo is worth waiting for.

Yeah I really liked the Samsung i500.... I can't believe that Samsung stopped making a similar model (the last one being the i539 for the Chinese market). The Kyocera 7135 was another nice phone. I wish it's screen hadn't cracked on me. My brother still has and uses his.

The slider would have to have a lock-open (unlike the T3), OLED would be nice, and a little foot in the back to stand up the device.

Put all that together in a Treo and if you might have a popular device that accommodates both the Treo and handheld markets.

Vampy,

If it slid out to HVGA, then that thing would be 28" long. Look at all the non-screen real estate below the display. Too much for sliding another 1.5" or so. All MHO.

Pat Horne

It is called 'visual clarity'.

- OLED uses less battery power.
- It has extremely wide viewing angles (so if you tilt left or right, you can still see , great for comfortable movie viewing).
- It is thinner than current TFT screens.
- Unlike TFT, if offers TRUE blacks. Also amazing for when viewing pictures or movies. Much more natural look onscreen
- Faster refresh rates, again for movies.

So why the hell isnt Palm selling devices with OLED?
Don't give me the cost argument because that doesnt stand up.
Sony has been offering to sell PDA OLEDs worldwide for years now.

Its just one of those dumb ass Palm things.

Sony may have used them in a few Japan-only PDAs, but the price reflected it.

Know what I'm betting? The POS version of this device will be 320x320 as usual, while the WinMob one will be like the Q et al and be 320x240. Now, the Palm version may have a higher resolution but physically smaller square screen in order to fit everything into the same formfactor.

Still, a true low-end Treo would've made MUCH more sense a year or two ago. But something like this is still a far better "extension" of the product line for Palm than a doomed leap of (live?) faith like the Foleo.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

I know there are many, many "what if" scenarios that we can play with Palm and their...usually questionable choices over the past 7 years or so. But one of the most telling ones was the tragic 18 months between the Treo 650 release and that of the 700p. Palm SHOULD have followed up on the 650 with the 700p (in a bug-free state, no less) in fall '05 if not sooner (as soon as the CDMA carriers' started having decent EVDO coverage, in fact). Then this new low-end Gandolf device should then have come out in '05 or early '06. Priced poperly and with strong e-mail/SMS/mp3 support (as Voice says) it would've been a huge home run, regardless of its color or questionable styling.

But to come out in fall '07 or later.....that's just too little, too late. Now, I'm not saying this will be a total failure. It's just a shame Palm didn't break from the hopelessly tired Treo 600-derived designs at least two years ago.

Ya know what other dirty little thought I had?
Palm should release a FrankenGarnet version of this Treo (branded as a Palm WX or something) with wi-fi instead of a cellular radio and a larger LCD. Sell it at retail for $200ish and position it as a Mylo-style chat/IM machine that also can play games and do "multimedia stuff". Heck, throw in some VOIP software in the box and--Bingo!--there's your instant T|C successor and something to keep the Foleo company on the retail shelves.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

it actually looks like a Pat Horne photochop created while experiencing an 80's acid flashback.

simply market and advertise this iPod killer with a bundled 2GB SD mini, and AD2P with low cost stereo WIRELESS headphones.

Oh good god, could we please stop using this tired phrase...especially where Palm is concerned? The only thing this device is going to kill is its creator. An appropriate name might be the Palm Imploder 800w.

Anyone who would believe that any such product from Palm is capable of challenging, let alone killing, iPod has been using PalmOS too long. No one wants PalmOS anymore. The Palm-powered logo is now a product warning label, not a mark of excellence.

-------------------------------
http://www.pocketfactory.com
http://www.elitistsnob.com

Even now, with minimal effort, Palm could produce a device that makes more sense than an iPod.

Not with the software they're peddling now they can't. You're the one knocking back one too many glasses of Chateau Le Kool-Aid if you believe Garnet in all its antiquated glory can honestly stand up to well designed software from Apple. Forget fanboy allegiances, we're talking logic here. Garnet can't even run my phone reliably. It's shit. And you think from this Palm can develop a killer product that consumers would want? My magic 8-ball says Not Likely.

You seem to forget, no one wants PalmOS anymore. Users and developers have abandoned the platform in favor of a better software experience. Anecdotally, everyone I know personally that once owned a Treo has since migrated to BlackBerries.

Palm isn't capable of creating innovative software. They're a follower, not a leader. And they can't even execute that strategy well. Give them another two years and they'll deliver a product that will beat the original iPod. Just you wait.

-------------------------------
http://www.pocketfactory.com
http://www.elitistsnob.com

Kent,

The dose of Foleo applied liberally to the forehead can heal Garnet Anger Syndrome (Gas). Help is on the way. :-D

Pat Horne

>>>Even now, with minimal effort, Palm could produce a device that makes more sense than an iPod.

Not with the software they're peddling now they can't.

No one is saying that Palm's current software offerings on its devices are cohesive. The point is that with little effort, Palm can put together a hardware and software package that makes more sense than an iPod.

You're the one knocking back one too many glasses of Chateau Le Kool-Aid if you believe Garnet in all its antiquated glory can honestly stand up to well designed software from Apple.

If you think TVoR has ever swilled Kool-Aid then you really need to buy a vowel. What you don't seem to understand is that hardware and software don't need to be perfect, they only need to be "good enough"; the hardware look pretty enough; and be offered at a cheap enough price to tempt potential customers. The average user is fairly clueless, so simplicity and reliability are the key. These design features USED to be the hallmark of Palm's offerings. The intuitive design of the iPod OS (which Apple never even designed) is what we should have been seeing coming out of Palm had they decided to continue to innovate rather than simply sitting back and lining their pockets with money in the go-go 90s and early 2000s.

Forget fanboy allegiances, we're talking logic here. Garnet can't even run my phone reliably. It's shit. And you think from this Palm can develop a killer product that consumers would want? My magic 8-ball says Not Likely.

FrankenPalmOS is indeed horribly behind the times, but with a little effort and the right applications, it can be set up to reliably do most of the things that 99% of users would be looking to do with a mobile device.
Give users a device that out-of-the-box has:
- A stable OS. After five years, there's NO excuse for Palm to be shipping a device with an unstable version of PalmOS 5. Just because the codemonkeys Palm employed were butchering PalmOS doesn't mean that PalmOS is irreversibly broken. With the right troop of codemonkeys and a little TLC, PalmOS can regain its former glory (admittedly only if it keeps its sights low).
- An intuitive MP3 player application. The touchscreen and D-pad should be exploited to allow navigation that rivals the iPod's ease-of-use.
- A tabbed launcher. The simplicity of an application like Launcher X makes Palm's default launcher look like it joke.
- A stable video player with a full suite of codecs. Palm can already handle video better than iPods, but no one other than techies are aware of this fact.
- An iTunes-like application with easy syncing of media from desktop and/or the Internet.
- And intuitive listing program like HandyShopper.
- A solid email program like ChatterEmail (coming Real Soon Now thanks to Palm buying out ChatterEmail)...
- A solid SMS application like Palm's current threaded SMS program.
- A solid file manager like Resco Explorer.
- A solid photo viewer like Resco Viewer.
- A solid backup application like Resco Backup
- A solid web browser like NetFront.
- A proper security application like TealLock.
- Reasonable battery life.
- A nice-looking screen.
- Trial/freeware versions of software (that can be fully deleted) like VideoHound, Zagat To Go, Vindigo, Ultrasoft Money, TealAuto, Vexed, Wine Guide, Weatherman, etc.

You seem to forget, no one wants PalmOS anymore. Users and developers have abandoned the platform in favor of a better software experience.

Bullsh!t. Users and developers have abandoned the platform because Palm abandoned the platform. When was the last time Palm released a new PDA? Has Palm released a new smart phone in the past four years significantly different than the Treo 600? When was a last time we saw any interesting designs in the PalmOS world like the tiny, Lexus-quality, magnesium clamshelled CLIE UX50 or OLED-screened CLIE VZ90? The answer to those questions is why users and developers have abandoned the platform.

Anecdotally, everyone I know personally that once owned a Treo has since migrated to BlackBerries.

Anecdotally, most of the people that live in my old neighborhood are lesbian/gay. Does that mean that everyone in the world is also lesbian/gay? Try again, Kent.

Palm isn't capable of creating innovative software.

Some have claimed that several of Palm's best codemonkeys were siphoned off to work on the FOOLeo. Based on the stunning lack of software evidently developed for this device thus far, that's not exactly reassuring, but perhaps the company has the potential to deliver better software once they regain their focus. But if they can't develop software in-house, there are plenty of off-the-shelf best-of-breed applications that Palm could easily license. ChatterEmail is a prime example of Palm buying a solution that they were not smart enough to be able to come up with themselves. While it's disappointing to hear that a single individual (Marc Blank) was able to come up with an email application FAR superior to anything that Palm's troops of codemonkeys were able to develop, it's also nice to know that with the right talent it doesn't take a lot of people to be able to come up with good PalmOS software. Palm would be wise to start pruning the dead wood from their company and reinvest the money in licensing applications that will provide users with a better out of box experience.

They're a follower, not a leader.

NEWSFLASH: Palm has always been a follower. But as Microsoft has shown repeatedly, sometimes it's okay to be a follower, as long as you're able to either improve on whatever the leaders have done before you or else if you are able to leverage your dominant position to allow your "good enough" copycat software to dominate those that came before you. The arrogance of Apple led to the downfall of the Newton, but now we've seen the same fate befall Palm. History repeats...

And they can't even execute that strategy well.

Palm has been run into the ground by a series of arrogant, lazy managers. A changing of the guard might reverse this trend before it's too late. Personally, I believe the combination of the upcoming iPhone and the distraction/resource wasting of the FOOLeo may prove fatal unless Palm's management aggressively and immediately reorganizes the company.

Give them another two years and they'll deliver a product that will beat the original iPod. Just you wait.

;-O

Sorry, but I won't be waiting. I'm quite happy with my old-school 512 MB and 1 GB iRiver MP3 players. I wouldn't touch one of those horrid-sounding iPods if you gave one to me for free.

Even though I believe that for most people convergence is the future, I'm finding that I continue to use single focus devices for most activities because I'm not willing to put up with the compromises currently imposed by convergence devices. While I would rather carry a separate MP3 player than listen to music stuttering through my Treo 700p, I'm sure that it won't be long before converged devices require few - if any - compromises. If Palm bothers to invest a little money in upgrading the design, specs and construction of the Treo lineup, it has a good chance to become the first company that puts out a device that ideally integrates several device categories (MP3 player, portable video player, radio, email device, instant messaging device, SMS device, Web browser, cell phone, pager, digital camera, digital camcorder, alarm clock, watch, GPS device, file transporter, entertainment guide, telephone book, etc.). Palm's biggest problem right now is that the iPhone has the advantage of both style and a company (Apple) that understands user interfaces and obviously won't sit on its a$$ for 10 years watching the competition pass it by.

Anyone wanna bet on how this is all gonna turn out?

TVoR sees the Elevation deal a LOT like the recent deal to buy out Chrysler. Right down to the facts that the newcomers are spending very little of their OWN money on the deals and that both Mercedes and Palm have been DESPERATELY looking for victims suitors for a loooooooong time. Expect a LOT of changes in the upcoming months at Palm. You have been warned...

TVoR

>>Palm isn't capable of creating innovative software. They're a follower, not a leader.

>>>>>Oh, rubbish. A perfect example is the Treo's SMS/MMS app: after all these years it's still the best messaging app on the planet.

IMHO it's a piece of cr@p: it has the unfortunate "feature" of sending your texts directly to some unfortunate person in Korea if you use "*82" in your address book to unblock the caller ID. Palm refuses to fix it with some simple scripting (still, on the 755!).

Also, it "nicely" hides your destination phone number in favor of the person's name... further obscuring the expensive bug mentioned in the first paragraph.

Perhaps the messaging program has it's merits over others, I've only sent text on the Treo. But when a program has such glaring (and expensive) problems, the programmers are well aware of it and refuse to fix it with some simple filters or programming, then I have to agree with the comments of the original poster above: "Palm isn't capable of creating innovative software." At least - not anymore. It's always been the third-party developers that have saved them from disaster time after time.