Steve Jobs on the Treo and Apple PDA
Apple CEO Steve Jobs made a number of comments about PDAs today at a conference in California. According to sources, he remarked that he was proud of not shipping an Apple branded PDA.
AppleInsider has a report on a number of comments Jobs made today while speaking at the All Things Digital conference in Carsbad, California. On the subject of handheld products they report:
Jobs stated that he is proud not only of the products Apple has shipped, but also the products Apple has decided not to ship. When asked to elaborate, Jobs Steve replied, "an Apple PDA."
During a Q&A session, one individual pleaded with Jobs (as he clenched his Treo), asking for Apple to produce a PDA/Phone hybrid. Jobs told the audience member it would be best to remain happy with his Treo.
Thanks to Roger W for the tip.
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RE: Jerk
[signature0]the secret to enjoying your job is to have a hobby that's even worse[/signature0]
[signature1]My PDAs: Visor --> Visor Neo (blue) --> Zire 71.... so ends the "marathon", for now[/signature1]
RE: Jerk
On one hand I think it sucks, because I would love to have a new Newton or an Apple branded PDA..... but on the other hand, when I look at how many companies seem to be struggling in the PDA market, I am not sure he's totally off-base.
Personally, I am a big fan of PDA's, but at the same time, it's hard to ignore all the analysts and stories indicating that pure PDA's seem to be falling off and people are more interested in specialized devices, or phones with PDA capabilities.
So, I don't think Jobs was completely offbase. I still wish Newton Inc. could have stayed around, and I would have loved to have seen a Newton 3000....... but at the same time, I have to acknowledge that if Newton Inc. was still around, they most likely would have gone the way of Be or something. The Newton OS was brilliant (and frankly, I still find it to be more elegant than some of what the current Palm OS and PocketPC OS'es do), but brilliance alone never helped the Newton take off.
-Mandroid
RE: Jerk
Steve has never cashed in following treads. He has cashed in making trends and he has the personality cult following him to prove it. His days studying Herman Gobels in Berkeley Psychology community in the 70s has really been applied. Ok, so he is no charasmatic facist leader of a country ... but boy did he apply that leadership style to technology.
Steve Jobs fans can flame about "Their Fuhrer" to me as much as they want. I should be amusing.
RE: Jerk
This is comsumer's falut, man. I just don't understand why people buying $300 iPod instead of buying cheap $99 Palm PDA. PDA can do more, bigger screen, and etc etc. Just use the rest of the $200 you have to buy more SD memories.
RE: Jerk (substituting iPod with a PDA???)
Reportedly there's (almost) no margin for Apple there.
and the iPod is Mono
I sure hope you mean monochrome, not monophonic... (that would be too gross :P)
This is comsumer's falut, man. I just don't understand why people buying $300 iPod instead of buying cheap $99 Palm PDA. PDA can do more, bigger screen, and etc etc. Just use the rest of the $200 you have to buy more SD memories.
What a uninformed, brain-dead comparison. Let's see...
iPod with biggest hard drive= $499 (40 GB)
iPod Mini = $249 (4 GB))
SD card 512MB = $97 (I'm going cheap!)
We'll want 8 cards to reach the 4 GB of the iPod Mini. That's $776. So tell me where do you get those negatively-priced PDAs, man. :P
Plus, tell me how to put the music on the cards. Surely not by Hotsync, huh? that's TERRIBLY slow, much slower than USB speed. So you should put there some program like Card Export for the Palm. But even saturating USB, you'll get a speed of about a 4x CD drive (600 KB/s). So perhaps you'll want a Firewire (or at least USB2) card reader too (about 33 times faster than USB).
Meanwhile, the iPod sports a Firewire connection (and USB2). The iPod's hard drive won't reach that speed, but reportedly you can upload at about (6 MB/s). (and no flipping of SD cards - one of the advantages of the iPod is that you can take all your music with you, and jumpt randomly thru your entire collection without skipping a beat)
Then, you have the capability to boot your computer from the iPod, or use it as a simple (and fast) external drive...
And, finally (but important on a music device), you'll surely want a case, a belt clip... those are included on the iPod.
RE: Jerk
If I want a pure music "walkman", I think I will go with MiniDisc. one disc is like less then $2 for 80min, and you can compress it upto 4X to get 320min of music for $2. Plus, MiniDisc is small and USB transfers too...
RE: Jerk
But you could put your entire CD collection there.
If you want less space, you can get a smaller iPod. I already pointed out to the 4Gb iPod mini.
But, more importantly, it doubles exactly as a FAST, bootable external hard drive. So you're free to use that space for whatever you want.
And yes, I can transfer through USB
You CAN, of course. But Firewire is one of the differences that make the iPod glow.
or even wireless...
That's the only advantage of the PDA - if you mean WiFi, of course, because Bluetooth will be less than 20 KB/s - hardly enough for streaming.
But then let's get sure you have the WiFi adapter for your computer, or add that to the price, huh?
Plus, I do gain other features like games, apps, tansfer file, cotact list, and etc along with music and video players.
Of course, those are advantages for the PDA. Just don't even try to say that any current PDA (even more so PalmOS devices) used as a MP3 player is a match for an iPod... as I have had to learn the hard way :P
If I want a pure music "walkman", I think I will go with MiniDisc. one disc is like less then $2 for 80min, and you can compress it upto 4X to get 320min of music for $2.
I've heard you can't compare the 4x LP format to AAC or MP3. I'm not sure about the 2x.
So let's assume the 2x is enough quality (though supposedly 1x is already like MP3 or AAC). That's 160 minutes of music, or 40 4-minute songs by the metrics used on the iPod merchandising. Now, the iPod mini can carry 1000 of those songs, so you'll need 25 minidiscs. That will be $50, that's good... except for the bag you'll need to carry. And what about a data disk option? and transfer speed?
(note that we are leaving aside the various nasties related to the ATRAC format, like enforced limits, conversions, quality... or have they got any better in these last 2 years?)
RE: Jerk
http://www.apple.com/ipod/behindthewheel.html
Of course it's read-only, but perhaps enough for some people... Dunno.
RE: MD
Sure it can't put 10,000 songs in it, but 40 is enough for me (2x) and I don't keep 10,000 songs on my PC just for the sake of it. I got much better stuff (digital TV broadcast) to fill my 2x 200Gb thingy. At the most I carry 4 MDs with me in my bag, two for compilations of British grindcore (John Peel's BBC Radio 1 sessions) and two latest album of whatever I just bought (current: Supergrass and er...The Corrs). MDs are so cheap, when one gets broken I can just chuck them out. What will you do if your 40Gb iPod's harddrive breaks down after 2 years?
And the MZ-E900's design is a classic. No wonder Aiwa's (Sony) new harddrive based mp3 HZ-WS2000 player looks curiously similar to the E900. At 68g (similar to my E900) that is way lighter than most Harddrive mp3 players. I might just be tempted to ditch MDs. Too bad the battery life is just 8 hours. Until then I will stick with PDAs or my E900 to listening portable music.
--
Psion 5> Vx > m505 > N770C > T625C > NR70V > e310 > T/T > HP h2210 > T/T3 & h4150
StarTac 75 > T28m > T39m > T68m > T610 > T630
RE: Jerk
Did I mention those MD are pretty too? :-p
RE: Jerk
And I (still?) don't feel like buying multiple SDs just for music... it's hard, thinking that for that price I can buy tons of CDRWs.
You haven't answered how is the ATRAC format and such going. I really wanted to buy a MD player about 2 years ago, but the nasty DRM politics convinced me to better get a simple MP3 CD player. I'll try to get the info... next time I want to buy something for music.
(...certainly not a PDA! :P)
RE: Jerk
I bought my first MD player 5 years ago, the beautiful Panasonic SJMJ70 (this thing still look stunningly better designed that the iPod) during the time where mp3 market was dominated by Rio with 32 and 64Mb players, so it made sense to get MDs. Who knows, if Rio released a 1Gb mp3 player then maybe I would never have invested in MDs.
I managed to squeeze 120 tracks on my 512Mb card on my h4150 in ogg format (64kbps). Uses around 200Mb. There is a 80Mb ogg file of Sara Cox's last BBC Radio One show as I missed it when it was aired.
ATRAC's DRM format does not bother me since I don't use NetMD and I don't copy MD to MD. Even then there are MD decks that can copy pure MD to MD with no loss in quality. I also own original CDs and won't bother investing in online music. Why should I pay for 128kbps compressed mp3 tracks when CD prices are dropping in the UK and I can get original (not pirated) CDs for £3 in Asia. What if I want to switch to another music format? I need to convert the mp3 to wav then to anoter format resulting in loss of quality.
I don't mind investing in a NetMD since I heard transfering the a album from a PC only takes a few minutes. Once 1Gb MDs blanks drop to £1 then I would upgrade my MD player. But PDA as a mp3 player is fine by me for days where I really don't need alot of music. And it still can't beat the combined 70 hours of battery life on my MZ-E900 (with clip on AA battery)!
Batmon:
Yeah, MDs are nice 'collectable art'. I have loads of those special limited edition MDs by Sony and TDK XS-iV made few years ago.
--
Psion 5> Vx > m505 > N770C > T625C > NR70V > e310 > T/T > HP h2210 > T/T3 & h4150
StarTac 75 > T28m > T39m > T68m > T610 > T630
RE: Jerk
RE: Jerk
Seems like the smart thing to do is stay the hell out of the PDA market. It's a niche device, and one that has a limited time left in the market place. PDA technology (like the Palm OS) may continue on in some form, but the PDA device itself is very quickly losing ground to better ideas.
The iPod is one such idea. People want portable music players. They were buying portable music devices long before the iPod came around. It's a massive worldwide market. Not everyone who owns a computer wants or needs a PDA (in fact very few people do). But just about everyone who owns a computer has a portable CD player, MD player or MP3 player. It's a larger market and the iPod is the best-designed device of its kind. I personally think it's a bit pricey, but I'd still own one if I could afford it.
Meanwhile, my Palm device which I used to depend on to get me through every day for years is now sitting on my desk gathering dust. My phone has all my conact and calendar info, my laptop has everything else (which I really don't need to take with me everywhere). If my Palm were half as good an MP3 player as an iPod, maybe then I'd have a reason to still use it. As it stands, it hasn't really been touched in a year.
Apple was wise to stay away from PDAs. Other companies should follow their lead.
HiMD = COOL~
http://forums.minidisc.org/viewtopic.php?t=3950
Read Tween Lines
I have to admit though, I wish Apple had swung.
Even with competition from Sony, Palm has innovated just enough to keep up, not to pull away from the pack.
Piloting Palm & Newton
As for the Newton MessagePad, it was a major money loser for Apple. Technology has barely caught up with what would have been necessary for something like the MessagePad to actually be a profitable product.
ipod / hybrid
RE: ipod / hybrid
RE: ipod / hybrid
Put a hard drive in a PDA.
Hard drives are tiny, these days. 1.8 inches. You could fit one inside a PDA enclosure without much difficulty. (Maybe that is overstating it. But PDAs are small these days; they can afford to make them a bit larger. Perhaps get rid of the SD slot, although that will be unpopular.)
Treat the hard drive as a VFS volume, and every music player for Palm OS will read it out-of-the-box.
We already have third-party software to mount SD cards on the desktop. These should also work with a hard drive without much difficulty. Although USB 1.1 is sloooow.
If you are keeping the SD slot, write a program to transfer the contents of the SD card to the hard drive, so that you can take heaps of photos with your digital camera, transfer them to the Palm, and take more photos. (This is what the Belkin Media Reader does for iPod, but it's a third-party add-on. This would be standard.)
RE: ipod / hybrid
If you have a TRGpro, you would have already been able to do this for several years. IBM's CompactFlash-sized MicroDrives work quite well.
If Palm was an innovative company, they would have put out a PDA like the CLIE UX-50 but incorporating the T³ screen and both CompactFlash and SD slots. Bundled with Word and Excel-compatible apps, an email app, a browser, Bluetooth and 802.11b, they could position it as an instant-on laptop replacement. The idea of these "Palmtops" could have reinvigorated Palm's PDA marketplace. Instead, they seem content to continue losing money selling cheaper and cheaper quality PDAs.
Had Toshiba become a Palm licensee, I believe such a "Palmtop" would have been their first product. It probably would have sold well to corporate customers.
Go ahead. Try it.
RE: ipod / hybrid
The problem is, PDAs are tiny too... like you say some lines afterwards. I guess the designers that worked to make them that way will recoil in horror seeing that you want to make them a bit bigger.
You could fit one inside a PDA enclosure without much difficulty. (Maybe that is overstating it. But PDAs are small these days; they can afford to make them a bit larger.
Yeah, it's quite easy in fact. Get a good knife, open up your PDA, and start making space between all those useless thingies they stuff these PDAs with. Perhaps you'll have to throw away some of the junk. When you feel the hard drive will feel cozy there, just drop it and close again.
That's it, your hard drive is inside your PDA. Now what?
Perhaps get rid of the SD slot, although that will be unpopular.)
Right now, yes, I'll bet it will be unpopular. However that could be an option... some advantages, some disadvantages.
I don't know if I'd buy a CF device, but that's just me.
Steve Jobs was right
But he made the right business decision. I doubt many companies are making significant money in the PDA market (not even Handspring when it most just sold the Treo).
Instead Jobs developed a product where he could lead innovation in a GROWING market. He has defined the PDA and the commercial download market. Now M$ is again copying Apple with their new version of the media player, that is compatible with 30 players EXCEPT the iPod.
Apple is like Micro$oft's R&D facility. Apple innovates, designs, tests, and makes and develops a new market...then M$ moves in with the big guns and copies it.
RE: Steve Jobs was right
:-)
Steve Jobs was pushed out!
The hard truth is Steve was pretty much not let in the Palm game when it was booming. Jeff and company didn't want him to overshadow and take over from Jeff's iconic leadership. Egos at stake? Hell yes! To this day, I have been told there is a "gentelman's agreement" that Jeff and Steve will never speak at the same trade show nor conference to avoid contending a crowd.
And like Steve is going to write "They didn't let me play with them cause the felt I was too out of control." Steve didn't want to make an enemy of the Palm community and the pre-PalmSource corporate struture had nothing to gain by Apple comming in with their "we lost to Microsoft" stigma that would pollute the Palm brand.
So instead, Steve eyes the MP3 market and goes, "Hmmm ... these whimps making these things don't know software as usual. Ok, I'll see what some engineers can do with an extra $100 in parts" And viola! the iPod was born.
And that's the truth :P
-- Passive Agressive types need not apply.
RE: Steve Jobs was pushed out!
It's so easy to agree with such a balanced statement.
So you mean Pixar, NeXT, Apple, all were born out of dumb luck? And the Apple come back too? the iMac, the iPod, OS X?
Well, that for sure is a long string of dumb lucky events.
Now imagine how lucky are the rest of the industry while they copy Apple. Well, in fact they need no luck, only dumb copying.
The hard truth is ...
Hey, where did I see that before?
Egos at stake? Hell yes! To this day, I have been told there is a "gentelman's agreement" that Jeff and Steve will never speak at the same trade show nor conference to avoid contending a crowd.
Very interesting. Now, what does that bring to the subject at hand?
You seem a bit too eager, don't you?
the pre-PalmSource corporate struture had nothing to gain by Apple comming in with their "we lost to Microsoft" stigma that would pollute the Palm brand.
Yeah, well said. That stigma is quite clearly displayed on the iPod. Well, I guess, anyway.
That "polluted" word there gave me creeps. Sounds a bit fanatical, doesn't it? Funny, seeing that the "we're losing to Microsoft" stigma would seem quite extended here.
So instead, Steve eyes the MP3 market and goes, "Hmmm ... these whimps making these things don't know software as usual. Ok, I'll see what some engineers can do with an extra $100 in parts" And viola! the iPod was born.
Yes, the software is exactly the thing that puts apart the iPod from the rest of MP3 players out there. In fact we were talking here about software all the time.
However, looks like you mean that the iPod is a work of engineers. I think that's exactly NOT the case. Last time I checked, looked like the iPod has gone iconic because of the design (specs, interface, looks). Or did I get it wrong?
In fact, I guess lots of companies have tried variations on the "let's throw some new parts there", and none of them succeeded. (Surely they were missing Jobs' dumb luck, huh?)
And that's the truth :P
And now that you have exorcised those inner demons, you can finally have some rest. :P
(Cr)Apple is lucky to be alive.
Didn't CrApple outsource the design of the iPod? Do you believe they came up with the OS themselves?
CrApple is still alive because:
1) It's in Microsoft's best interest for them to be around.
Less important reasons include:
2) They have an obedient base of Mac Cult Members to sell their wares to.
3) They are VERY good about style and know the importance of good industrial design in selling consumer electronics. (Apple is essentially the opposite of TRG/HandEra).
4) There will always be a group of Microsoft haters that will do anything to avoid using Windows.
5) Their OS actually isn't all that bad - as long as you're willing to put up with the ever-present problem of trying to find software that runs on Mac.
6) Tangerine iMac. No, it's not about style...
7) They have a fanatical base of Mac Cult Members to sell their wares to.
8) They have a rabid base of Mac Cult Members to sell their wares to.
9) They have a zombified base of Mac Cult Members to sell their wares to.
10) They have a brainwashed base of Mac Cult Members to sell their wares to.
RE: Steve Jobs was right
And to the guy previously with a real name and now goes by ";-((" you have it right. I'm surprised they don't hand out free Kool-Aide at MacWorld. Steve is a charasmatic leader that follows the great charasmatic dictator styles that J. Edgar Hoover, Hilter, Mossolini, JBL and King James I all did to have a crowd almost mindlessly follow them.
Frankly, I'm surprised that Steve Jobs hasn't made a run for a political office yet. He could become mayor of Cupertino, CA at the drop of a hat if you ask me.
RE: Steve Jobs was right
Didn't CrApple outsource the design of the iPod? Do you believe they came up with the OS themselves?
Yes, they outsourced it. But, I guess that this furthers my point, not RhinoSteve's. Thanks anyway. ;D
CrApple is still alive because:
1) It's in Microsoft's best interest for them to be around.
Yes, Apple serves them as R&D, and stops a bit the monopoly-related problems.
So what's the point?
3) They are VERY good about style and know the importance of good industrial design in selling consumer electronics. (Apple is essentially the opposite of TRG/HandEra).
Yes, I said that.
4) There will always be a group of Microsoft haters that will do anything to avoid using Windows.
I'd say it's Windows haters that end up hating everything Micro$oft, since their quality standards and related politics are everywhere. It'd be a bit strange just hating Micro$oft for the sake of it, huh?
The funny thing is, they could be using the FREE Linux, or a selection of other FREE OSes, on cheap, Windows capable hardware (so they could just boot up Windows in case on dire need) - and yet they prefer paying for non-Windows capable Apple hardware. So misguided! (But hey, what would you expect from someone hating Micro$oft?)
5) Their OS actually isn't all that bad - as long as you're willing to put up with the ever-present problem of trying to find software that runs on Mac.
Yeah, some software does not even appear on the Mac, so I am forced to look for an alternative. Pity is, a number of times the mac alternative is better, and I end up with no version for Windows.
Then, there are times when there is no Mac alternative for the exact thing I'm doing on the Windows side, so I just fire up VirtualPC - and well, that's it.
And finally, you wouldn't believe what the opensource community has available.
However, it's funny that a PC & PocketPC & Palm user friend of mine joked that, if I was tired of looking for software for "my platform of choice", then I should think twice about getting a PalmOS device... heh.
6) Tangerine iMac. No, it's not about style...
I don't like ANY of the iMacs (well, except for the flower-power one :D). But hey, they work. And hey, they have sold them like there was no tomorrow. So, what's exactly your problem?
Perhaps if PalmOne put out a translucid Bondi-blue device they could sell a bit more? :D
Well, no, forget that one. After all, the whole industry has already fed up with copying the color and shape schemas of the iMac, and anyway the hip things now are aluminium and white plastic.
Now, for 2,7,8,9,10: hey, now that you're getting repetitive, why stop at 10? If you reach 20, surely that will mean you're even righter. (hint: you'll need numbers 11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20. If you want more, ask for them, I'll tell you how to continue).
Anyway: now that we're chatting so nicely, could you please explain how is the OS 5 Bluetooth SD drivers subject going? Have you contacted Mr. Mace yet, or any other of your Palm contacts? Less than two weeks left for summer...
Or perhaps I shouldn't even have started taking you seriously?
RE: Steve Jobs was right
Do you? If so, explain why, please.
And yes, Steve is totally full of lots and lots of dumb luck.
That's possible. Anyway, I pointed out that Apple, NeXT, Pixar, a number of smaller and clearer examples, and the Apple-copying industry beg to differ.
...or at least, it's such a long string of dumb lucky events that then perhaps the boy is blessed and we apple-brainwashed zombies are rightly worshipping him.
Steve is a charasmatic leader that follows the great charasmatic dictator styles that J. Edgar Hoover, Hilter, Mossolini, JBL and King James I all did to have a crowd almost mindlessly follow them.
When you said that Apple would pollute the Palm brand, I didn't say you sounded kinda nazi because I felt that it was a bit too far fetched and disgusting. But now it's you who make strange relationships. What is exactly your problem, man? Or do you mean that this is normal?
Frankly, I'm surprised that Steve Jobs hasn't made a run for a political office yet. He could become mayor of Cupertino, CA at the drop of a hat if you ask me.
Why major?? Obvious joke: who would you vote? Arnold or Steve? I know I'd vote Steve for sure! :D
RE: Steve Jobs was right
Well, no, forget that. Too awful.
About "niche of fashion conscious yuppies": does that explain Bondi, Strawberry, Tangerine, Dalmatian, FlowerPower iMacs and +2 millions of iPods sold? (that's between 8 and 25% of MP3 players market share, depending on who you ask to)
About Microsoft and "Apple on life support": Yeah, they helped. Yeah, Apple was useful to them to stop the DOJ.
What you are seemingly ignoring is that the money also served (supposedly) to settle the years long suit that Apple had against Microsoft because of M$'s copying of Quicktime - and aspects of the GUI, IIRC. Also, that near-death experience looks like demonstrating that "mac cultists" were leaving Apple to die, so perhaps they were not that cultists.
Hey, I love these two:
People simply feel better targeting those who are superior to them because it gives them a (false) sense of power.
Erm, how was your message titled? "Frosty blah blah"?
Like how the Cultists (both Mac and Palm) refer to company directors by their first names ("Steve said", "Jeff and Donna said"...) as if they are personal friends with these individuals.
Well, you invent contacts at Palm and talk about secrets you share with the CEO (remember those ultra-secret OS 5 BT SD drivers "your sources" predicted? those ultra-secret drivers that are not published, but about which the CEO will talk to whomever asks nicely?).
About "Linux not ready for prime time" and "issues that Windows users will never see": how many times have you had to reinstall your Windows systems? How many times have you lost hours of work in one way or another because of Micro$oft OS and/or apps? Do you think it's acceptable that M$ apps fail like they do on M$ OSes? Do you use Outlook and InternetExplorer? Have you ever heard about "Blaster", "CodeRed", "ILoveYou"?
Do you think that there is any kind of explanation to the fact that free OSes (there's more to life than Linux, you know) made by hobbyists are more stable and capable than OSes made by one of the mightiest companies on Earth?
Finally, when was the last time that you tried Linux, you clown? (or anything non-Windows and non-Palm :)
About "Palm OS library destroys PPCs": Yeah, as already stated too many times, Palm OS has lots of nice calendars, clocks and even calculators. Meanwhile...
http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_story.asp?ID=6640
Be sure to look at the dates of these (open source!)
http://ppc.palmopensource.com/?more=10
http://ppc.palmopensource.com/?more=3
http://ppc.palmopensource.com/?more=6
Well, and the entire http://ppc.palmopensource.com/?category=top_links
Every time I see that page (or any of a bunch of similar ones) I must force myself to remember that "PocketPCs are a joke"...
Now, should I look for commercial software too?
And the funniest: http://pocketprof.org/running_palm_os_software.htm
(be sure to peruse the bottom of that page, where it talks about emulating PalmOS on a PocketPC)
Why use VirtualPC when you can just use the real thing?
Oh, come on. You should know that Micro$oft itself has bought VirtualPC and are integrating it into their OSes. They don't use it in the same way, of course, but the reasons why it's useful are the same: emulate the OS into a sandbox so you can: (1) have its functionality, (2) without suffering the problems. I've been able to do things on VPC that were impracticable / impossible on a real PC.
About style: I think you didn't get it. I said aluminium and white plastic are now / are going to be hip because that's what Apple is doing now.
http://www.apple.com/powermac
http://www.apple.com
You heard it there. (*chuckle*)
About Mac FidoPoo: surely you would say that CliePoo's are perfect, that Sony once more pushes the envelope using new materials, that there's no need for [whatever that is missing] since you can buy [whatever extra] for a mere $199, and that PocketPCs lack that distinctive sticky feeling and foul smell that makes your device unique.
About the mythical OS 5 BT SD drivers:
I gave you the facts.
How do you define "facts", man?
fact [fækt], noun
1 an event or thing known to have happened or existed
2 a truth verifiable from experience or observation
...
So: No, you have not given any facts.
I do have one for you, though it's not new.
http://makeashorterlink.com/?L34F51C78
I'd love that you just presented some simple link to those drivers - or **** for ever.
I posted Michael Mace's and Ben Combee's email addresses.
Have you ever heard about "burden of proof"?
What you need to post is some demonstration that your "fact" is not the heap of sh*t that it seems.
I even asked Mr. Mace and Mr. Combee to comment on the drivers at Palminfocenter.
You *even* asked them. Wow.
Mr. Combee stating that he does not know about development of those drivers - or lack thereof:
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comment_view.asp?ID=6879#95025
If Mace/Combee don't reply, you can interpret this as you wish, but my source is accurate.
Well, as a matter of fact THIS was predicted.
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comment_view.asp?ID=6879#94931
Where is NeXT?
Apple + NeXT's NextStep = Mac OS X. You don't read the news?
About Facey's Soapbox Mode: kinda ironic after your unfortunate post at
http://www.palminfocentre.com/comment_view.asp?ID=6803#94687
But, as I already said, I agree with keeping that out of this.
RE: Steve Jobs was right
1) So, finally, you have not proof of what you (or your magical Palm Insider gnomes) predicted because somehow I am responsible of checking it? Lovely.
1b) You sound like you don't care to check what Mr. Combee has to say about the drivers? Interesting. Have you at least read my prediction? You know, that's where I said "if no one confirms the drivers existence, you'll say you're right"?
2) Free OSes: what's the matter, you only know Linux? Have you ever heard of the BSD family? FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD? BSDs are said to run 20% of the busiest sites on the net. Yahoo is one.
3) Apple + NextStep = Mac OS X. Take a look at the Cocoa classes at Apple's developer site. They all start by "NS", like NSString: NextStep. Or look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocoa_(software)
3b) Incidentally, NextStep is a derivative of FreeBSD. Quite a different Un*x "family brach" from Linux. Google for that.
4) Somehow I expected you to be the only human walking the face of the planet not having experienced problems with Windows 95. Now, it's funny to see you say that "post 98" they get flakier. LOL! Furthermore, you assign crashes' fault to "junior programmers". You mean M$ Office(s) works OK on their very OS(es)?
5)"You never open mails from unknown sources". Well, I have a mac, so I don't have that problem. In fact, if you don't use Outlook, you're almost problem-free. However, perhaps that's why Mr. Mace didn't answer your mail - if you ever wrote him?
6) Looks like you didn't read the part about emulating Palm OS on the Pocket PC (to run those 10 apps that you say are not available there). Nor the part about why VirtualPC is useful - to the point of M$ buying it to integrate on their OSes. Heh.
7) About "we're not in court (yet)": you asked about where do I live, and asked about how brave I was. I answered. Now what? :D
8) RhinoSteve? Why are you always trying to get other people in the subject? I requested an explanation for his nonsensical post and he answered bragging / implying he is / was an Apple employee - as if that gave meaning to his post (sounds kinda like you, huh?). So the post is still without explanation. However, it's funny how you need to bring victories home.
9) No, not Johannestown.
10) Yes, my grammar is confuse. That's the problem of learning english with Dilbert - they never use long sentences. :D
Well, let's finish this.
Your "answers" not only don't bring anything worthy to the subject (whatever subject), but keep insulting left and right. So I don't need any more of them - until you present any fact (or retreat) about those stealth OS 5 BT SD drivers that some magical gnome (err, I mean, some Very Important Palm Insider) told you about.
And my answers seem to be of little help to you, as you ignore any info offered - even after opening your eyes to some radical new concepts like "sharing files over a network" (http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_story.asp?ID=6770#93705), so surely I'd be better off by just not answering.
Meanwhile, the rest of the people is surely fed up with all of this. (if someone really wants me to answer, just ask me and I'll do my best :P. Somehow I'm not expecting lots of requests).
So Facey, I guess this is my last post to you. I said Privoxy can stop lots of annoyances, and I'm betting it can even stop YOU. Since the admins aren't IP-filtering you, looks like I'll have to do it locally. Let's see what can be done with some regex substitutions on a table-formatted page like PIC's comments :). If someone is interested on the method, just ask.
(but don't be sad, you're so nice that you'll always have lots of f(r)iends to play with)
Confused ...
~ "Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed." - DV ~
they probably can't
Despite presenting itself as an innovator, it looks like Apple is barely keeping up with maintenance on OS X and a few targetted applications. The days of Apple's Advanced Technology Group are long gone, and most of the people working on Newton have left the company as well.
Once Apple can piggy-back a PDA on top of OS X, maybe they have a chance, but handheld hardware isn't powerful enough yet to run OS X. A tablet formfactor iBook is more likely, maybe for the educational market. But given Microsoft's second flop with pen-based computing, that can't look very attractive to Apple either.
RE: they probably can't
They surely have some history to present themselves as innovators, don't they?
Once Apple can piggy-back a PDA on top of OS X, maybe they have a chance, but handheld hardware isn't powerful enough yet to run OS X.
You seem too sure about that.
Don't you think they could strip down Darwin and put some lighter-than-Aqua GUI on top of it?
Even on the Zaurus: what about some combination of Linux + GNUstep?
http://www.gnustep.org
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3222387077.html
http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3364064037.html
Man, THAT's mouth-watering...
Apple, innovative?
http://www.apple.com/airportexpress/
:)
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