palmOne Responds to the Pocket PC Rumor
UPDATED Yesterday, a large number of PDA enthusiast websites as well as some mainstream online media reported on a highly speculative report claiming palmOne executives "admitted" they are working to make a device with Microsoft's Pocket PC platform. PalmInfocenter gets the real word with a official response from palmOne.
The latest round of speculative reports that palmOne was considering using the Pocket PC Operating system for a future handheld broke yesterday and a large number of enthusiast sites picked up the story. Started by an Analyst report by Needham & Co., the rumor is nothing new and seems to be brought up every six months or so. In fact, this question seems to always get asked one way or another at palmOne press events. The only reason it continues to surface is because palmOne never outright denies the rumor, which leads some to the assumption that they are keeping their future options open or are using the rumors as leverage over PalmSource.
But while palmOne claims to be a platform agnostic company, they are solidly behind the Palm OS and are committed to a multiyear contract with PalmSource. palmOne's current contract with PalmSource to use the Palm OS does not expire until December 2006. While the contract is non-exclusive and palmOne is free to use any OS it desires, it is still contractually obligated to fulfill minimum commitment requirements with PalmSource.
While the rumor may excite the handheld fans and stir up the numbers on Wall st, it is not based on any substantive information and palmOne feels that the analyst report misunderstood what palmOne executives actually said.
palmOne spokesperson Jim Christensen provided PalmInfocenter with this statement:
We believe that the folks at Needham misunderstood our palmOne execs: no one from palmOne expressed the sentiments attributed to us, either at our October 5 Securities Analyst meeting or in the individual analyst meetings that followed.It's a well-known fact that palmOne has attracted a large and loyal customer base delivering products that employ PalmOS, and that we are committed to a multiyear contract with PalmSource that includes a $40 million minimum annual commitment. We have often said that the PalmOS today has the best combination of power, ease of use, user interface and flexibility to innovate on top of the OS.
Of course, the company is open to evaluating products using additional operating systems if doing so would grow the marketplace or otherwise meet customer needs that currently are not addressed. This is nothing new. In fact, it was part of the rationale for the spin-off -- so that both companies could create their own futures.
Update
An additional report on News.com today cites yet another source, that claims palmOne is considering many different OS options. It speculates that palmOne has been quietly exploring a Linux derived OS as well as working more closely with Microsoft.
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Eartth to palmOne!
-- which you are doing your damnedest to drive away! How's that market share holding up? How are those T5 sales?
Where is COBALT?
Where is a unit to satisfy *US*?
RE: Eartth to palmOne!
Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com
Cobalt Release Candidate 6.3: Spring, 2005? Mon dieu!
This would actually be funny if it wasn't so close to reality.
The truth is, we don't really need Cobalt. When Cobalt Release Candidate 6.3 is announced in Spring, 2004, will any decent hardware be shipping with it? Not likely - just a second tier smartphone or two. And will it offer any any significant advantages over PalmOS 5.2/(patched + quilted)5.4? Not likely. The BeOS contribution appears to have been pure BS based on what I've seen. We are not impressed, Palm.
Pssssst: The Emperor has no clothes. Pass it on.
******************************************************************
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.
RE: Eartth to palmOne!
This has to be totally suspect. Just plain suspect. Why won't palmOne concede to release a Cobalt-Powered Device? This is just ridiculous!!!
I pledge to the Palm-Powered community that I will seek to make a better handheld through research one day!!!
RE: even worse now.
This just stirs the pot even more. Ugh.
RE: even worse now.
pen & paper -> m515 -> Zire72 -> TH55
RE: even worse now.
RE: even worse now.
But I have to say that if I were them, I would not "deny" the possibility of other operating systems either. That would be plain dumb.
RE: even worse now.
Denial by default
This is exactly the situation that palmOne is trying to avoid.
If they denied rumours every time that they were false, then any time a rumour comes up and they don't deny it, people will assume that it is true.
If they confirmed rumours every time that they were true, then people would just keep throwing out random rumours in the hope that one of them is true, so it can be confirmed. (Cobalt upgrade for the T5 for $30, anyone?)
If they just ignored rumours, then people can't make any assumption of whether it is true or not. That's why they don't comment on rumours or talk about unannounced products. They're muddying the waters.
What about the Ipaq with PalmOS
RE: What about the Ipaq with PalmOS
http://churchoflivingfaith.com/images/dellx50p.jpg
Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com
RE: What about the Ipaq with PalmOS
Likewise, iPAQ has a smaller market share than Palm. Producing a Palm device would reduce the credibility of their range and give them a Sony sized market share in Palm world. In would come Dell to sweep away all that remains of their disillusioned customers.
Either move would spell the death of the respective company. Noone’s that stupid.
Rest easy, everyone; it’s not going to happen.
RE: What about the Ipaq with PalmOS
Nick
Pocket PC and palmOne
MS Pocket PC 2003 (etc..) has the built in concept that it works "better" with MS desktops. If Palm/palm/pa1m (whatever) really wish to increase/maintain market share they should really be making a lot more noise about their compatibility with the applications on the dominant desktop OS.
All those Palm apps that work better with MS format files better start making a lot of noise otherwise we will see the continued (and inevitable) Microsoftization(tm) of the handheld arena. Instead we see ads about being mobile. I love being mobile, however; if I can't sync up at the end of the day easily then where is the benefit?
Aside: I still wouldn't buy a PPC device if it ran Cobalt/Garnet/Boozle (whatever) as I don't like the rectangular design that all PPC's must conform to. I also believe that the T5 is trying to cop that design and thus lose it's unique identifiable niche. So, if you want to stir the rumour yet more perhaps this is an exit strategy.
My .02$
RE: Pocket PC and palmOne
What other design exists? A round screen? Square screen? An elegant Hp19xx, 41xx series or X50 with Palm OS would be killer compared to the T5E2. The older HPs are very attractive from a form standpoint. If you're talking about horrid the new HP "Darth Vader Pez dispenser" designs just released, then I understand what you mean.
Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com
PalmOne entertaining PPC for one reason...
Palm just doesn't seem "corporate" enough these days, which is funny because they used to be too corporate! PalmOne became a consumer brand courtesy of the zire series but lost their way on the high-end after the T|3 (a great device).
I think PalmOne knows PDAs are declining in consumer markets because smartphones/cell phones are taking over. And PPCs have quietly taken over the corporate space because of brainwashed MIS directors who love Microsoft's "off-sites" and "summits." So why not look into leveraging excellent hardware engineering and the "I have enough problems with compatibility" PPC for MIS stooges...
Nokia 3650 bluetooth magnate
Palm blows smoke
Palm is the forerunner in handheld computing hands down. Pocket Pc is in second place. Palm has lead the sales for years running and kept the public anticipating the next new design. Now they are stumbling with the failure to produce OS 6 in the T5 unit. The public is ranting and Palm is stuttering. The industry is pointing to smartphones as the new fad. Palm quarterly reports look weak. Support service is faultering. Leadership within the corp is changing and changing. The public is having second thoughts.
These are the signs of a company making mistakes and which has become vulnerable. In comes Microsoft.
Microsoft sets back and lets Palm run like a wild dog in design, development and getting the consumers excited about handheld computing. They watch all the creative juices flow from Palm to the home hobbyist Palm software developer. They see many third party software titles appear, not to mention hardware to enhance the machines. They watch all the problems surface and get conquered. In short, Microsoft watches Palm build the PDA world, debug it first, spend tons on R&D and promote the product.
Now, here is the clincher that is so subtle.
One day while Palm is in a weakened state, Microsoft approaches and says they love the smartphone work Palm is doing. We would like to be a part of this innovative design. Palm says no. Microsoft cracks open the wallet and swings big bucks in front of them and says, "Here. It's yours. Do what ever you want with it and let us add our OS to your design". Palm, needing the capitol to push forward, sees dollar signs and snatches it away. Thus your news media story. Microsoft just bought play time at the expense of Palm. The Treo will be the test drive unit for this new endeavor and Microsoft is going to have a field day in advertising it.
What does this all mean?
Palm has just sold out to Microsoft. They may not realize it yet, but they did. Microsoft now has an in road and will quickly smash them into the ground. Palm will cease to function within the next three years. You can bet on that. Microsoft won't even flinch. I suspect that Microsoft already has people woring inside Palm and ready to make the transition when the time is right. Sounds like a conspiracy theory doesn't it? hehe.
Bottom line. In the corporate world, money is power. When you can buy off a company and wipe them out to put you into the number one slot, do it. That is how they feel. Remember, Microsoft doesn't like being in second place. Microsoft feels that the handheld has reached a plateau of development which is stable and it is time to get aggressive in the market. This is the first strike.
So what do we do now? To each his own. I suspect when the real story is let loose about what is going on, you will see all kinds of things happening. People angry over Palm selling them out. PPC users singing praises. And, upstart OS companies going after a whole new arena of potential. Most everyone will be confused or have mixed emotions about what to do. But really, isn't this the type of world we live in now?
I know some may see this post as rambling, but I have to tell you. My experience in the business world leads me to come to the conclusion posted above. It is the only logical conclusion. It is being passed off as a rumour in the news mills, but this time it has a tone that is different and Palm did not really deny it, they dodged it.
Kevin
Addicted to Palm
RE: Palm blows smoke
PalmOne is turning into a Microsoft because they want to be bought, merged, or funded by Microsoft. Or they have schizophrenic multi level management issues.
On top of it, PalmOne doesn’t appear to be in favor of supporting small third party developers. I get the feeling P1 wants them to go away. Look at what P1 has already done to the handheld email industry. First P1 bought or got MultiMail in the separation and then just about dumped the product to get into bed with Good and Notify because those companies had some VC money. When that didn't seem to go well, P1 went back to MM (Versa Mail) with the active sync stuff. Now they got a new pony show of some copycat product from Seven for God knows why. In the mean time PalmOne is in denial of the existence of better products like Chatter, CMM, MailWave, & Snapper.
Call it as I see it.
RE: Palm blows smoke
RE: Palm blows smoke
== We are not working on a MSoft-based anything.
All they said was:
== We didn't say we were working on a Msoft-based anything.
For all we know, one of the contractual terms they have with PSRC is not to mention active work on any alternative OS for some period of time...
RE: Palm blows smoke
Addicted to Palm
RE: Palm blows smoke
They had a meeting and posed this question: "how can we get as much money as possible out of this sinking ship? The hardware biz just sucks!" Since they're in it for themselves at the expense of employees/shareholders they had to capitalize as quickly as possible (re: SCO/Linux BS lawsuit). No blame here really since every corporate mngmnt thinks the same way.
Let's see... capture as much smartphone market share as possible before Microsoft/Nokia start a bidding/investment war. Get Microsoft STOCK or Nokia Euros. OR, build and design smartphones for Microsoft. It's cloudy for me, but judging from human nature/experience/capitalism the management could give a crap about PDAs (T|5 anyone) and will focus ENTIRELY on getting someone to scoop up the Treo design. There is no loyalty any more to anything so dont' get your hopes up Palmlovers...
-- a palmlover
Nokia 3650 bluetooth magnate
RE: Palm blows smoke
I think I'll just keep deceiving myself about P1. Feels better that way.
"Yeah, that killer T6 is on the way with VGA, OS6, dual-wireless, .25 thin and smaller than a wristwatch for $249" wooohoo.
Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com
RE: Palm blows smoke
Don't expect anythig from Palm for the rest of this year. The news story just shot a big hole in their sales potential.
By the spring, you will see a device running OS6. It won't be a Palm or Treo, but some other product. Don't forget, there are things running Palm OS. I doubt there will be any new Palm models released in the spring either. No more Tungstens, Zires or such.
In the first quarter of 2005, Palm will announce what they are holding back from admitting to right now. We have joined with Microsoft. This will cause mixed reactions from the public as to what to do, how to feel and "what about my stock?" The announcement will probably be made to look like an experimental joint project that is looking for advancing the PIM and communication spectrum. Expect politician speeh in this one. You know the drill. Tons of meaningless words.
By the summer of 2005, MicroPalm will release the first joint smartphone. Most likely Treo.
After all this, your guess is as good as mine.
This worst part of this deal is for guys like me who write code for Palm devices. Now what? There goes some of our revenue if we don't change to the other guy. It reminds me of a book I read by Spencer Johnson entitled, "Who Moved My Cheese". It is about how we deal with changes in our work and life. If you haven't read it, do. With this perspective in mind, I will begin to adjust my situation to accomodate the new one. Why sit back and cry about it when you can capitalize on it.
Addicted to Palm
RE: Palm blows smoke
From a legal standpoint I don't see how Microsoft can buy out PalmOne. Admittedly since the spinoff of PalmSource its more possible as it would not involve reduced competition as far as OSes go. PalmOne is hands down the single largest licensee of the Palm OS. So while it would not be an overt antitrust violation, the Eurocrats would probably be all over Microsoft like a cheap suit. I am not so sure about the DOJ and the FTC here in the US. Not so much because of politics (Down Mike! Down!
Anyway, why get in bed with PalmOne when they are trying to set fire to it on their own with their current business plan?
RE: Palm blows smoke
If I were going to wiggle my way into a company, I would start at the heart and work out to the extremities. Show yourself to be an interested, team playing kind of person while in the background you are pulling out the nails fo the boards behind you. You create your own stability when the whole thing flies apart and you save the day. They look at you as the savior of the business, when in fact you were the one who took it down. You get the raise, the new position and the big house. The former players get the boot because they failed to keep things going.
Where there is smoke, there is fire.
Addicted to Palm
Why would Microsoft bother? Palm's already killing itself.
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Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.
RE: Palm blows smoke
The top guys at Palm know what is going on. Don't fool yourself. This is going to happen.
Addicted to Palm
RE: Palm blows smoke
For $ome reason I doubt Gates even thinks about Palm more than once on a monthly basis. Bigger fish to fry, although I'm sure Palm is somewhere down in the MSFT "Squash List".
Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com
RE: Palm blows smoke
Either MS has had a dramatic change of heart or MS is not interested in their own PPC OS let alone Palm OS.
As for the Palm using PPC - I can think of better ways for a company to commit suicide. It doesn't make sense for them to do this. They'd never sell. Don't forget that Toshiba and Panasonic have left the PPC market too.
I think it's all silly rumours.
RE: Palm blows smoke up your a**
I disagree. If managed properly, Palm could have (and still might) become a significant cause of lost profits for Microsoft. The Windows/Intel hegemony that has been entrenched over the past 15 years owes its existence partly to the fact that businesses like Standards and Compatibility. Palm set the standard for PDAs, much as "Wintel" has done for desktops and laptops. But Palm's so-called leadership failed to think outside the (narrow PDA) box and look at other ways to expand the PalmOS market. Last year, Sony's UX50 showed everyone that PalmOS PDAs had the potential to become mini laptop replacements. We also started to see a few adventurous souls using those slick little Treo 600 as laptop replacements in certain situations. Push those designs a little further (e.g. stretch the UX50 into the size of a Sharp Zaurus or ever larger http://www.dynamism.com/zaurus/ include a GSM radio, VPN app for remote access to your desktop, Word/Excel compatible apps, etc) and for a lot of people, suddenly they wouldn't need a laptop anymore. Palm could have got a lot of sales by marketing themselves to businesses as a way to cut the cost of laptops. And every Wintel laptop sale lost is less money for Billy G's Swiss bank accounts. More importantly, the presence of a cheap, simple, reliable alternative to Wintel would get IT people to start becoming more receptive to other solutions. Palm could have become a threat if only they had marketed themselves properly to businesses. Gates didn't become the wealthiest person in the world by ignoring threats. The fact that IT people choose PPC over PalmOS because of perceived better compatibility with Windows shows both how miserably Palm has failed in marketing itself to businesses and how effective Microsoft is at controlling its market. With a litle effort, Palm could STILL be able to leverage its OS and the Treo lineup to get more than a foot in the door of the corporate world (where the REAL profit potential is).
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Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.
RE: Palm blows smoke
Thanks for the ride, palmOne.
>>biting my tongue otherwise. see that blood?<<
Why not?
Tungsten T7
PPC Diebold Edition 1.1W
Bah....
I guess I don't see what the big deal is...
We've all seen what's happened when competition heats up the PDA market. We can buy PalmOS devices with 320x480 screens and sound now.
The reason that P1 split from Palmsource was specifically to separate the hardware from the software. The speculation that P1 could be coming out with devices that run a different OS should be no surprise to anyone.
RE: I guess I don't see what the big deal is...
No, the thing that P1 needs to do is get serious about their corporate offerings and the Tungsten line. Let the Zires exist only as $200 and below consumer models resembling Pez dispensers. They need to focus all of their efforts on releasing several strong models in a row and get their build quality issues resolved. The Treo 650 may likely even drive some people who are drooling over a 650 but cannot afford it or convince their employer to pay for it to purchase a Tungsten model for their own personal use. In fact, I could almost see the Treo sending nearly as many referral or trickle-down PDA sales P1's way than existing Palm owners migrating to a Treo. Most of the current Palm owners either have BT cell or have no need for a smartphone.
Palm is the Netscape of 2004. Billy G. wins again. *SIGH*
No, the thing that P1 needs to do is get serious about their corporate offerings and the Tungsten line. Let the Zires exist only as $200 and below consumer models resembling Pez dispensers. They need to focus all of their efforts on releasing several strong models in a row and get their build quality issues resolved.
Very well said. It's a shame Palm's executives are too busy plundering the company to bother making these simple changes that could easily save the company from further losses.
Palm's recent actions suggest the company has a white knight up its sleeve ("Wild" Bill?), so it really doesn't care what happens to profitability (or even the development of OS and hardware designs). This past month will probably be remembered as the turning point for Palm. They are now in total self-destruct mode. PPC will probably control over 50% of the market before the end of the year and it now seems inevitable that Palm will pull a Netscape within two years.
I almost can't believe this is happening. It's like watching an accident happen in slow motion...
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Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.
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Still no denying
No wonder it keeps cropping up.... and people *still* believe they'll launch a device with WME, no matter what p1 says.