Rumors Abound on New Sony and Palm Handhelds (Updated)

Posted By: Ed Friday, September 7, 2001 8:31:58 AM

The Sony N710C is now listed as "sold out" on the SonyStyle webstore. According to a source who asked to remain anonymous, this is because Sony will be announcing the N760C in just over a week, which is pretty much the same as the N710C but with OS 4.1 instead of OS 3.5. It will be announced on September 17 and retailers will begin to take pre-orders at that time. It will be available on September 28 for $500.

Last month, details on the Palm m125 were leaked but the rumored release date came and went with no sign of it. Another source, with an excellent track record, now says the m125 will be announced at the beginning of next week.

As was mentioned yesterday, the m125 has already shown up in the latest Dell Business Solutions catalog, of which HandAble has a picture.

The m125 will have a 33 MHz Dragonball VZ processor, 8 MB of RAM, and non-upgradable ROM. It will have an SD expansion slot, use Palm's Universal Connector, and cost $250.

PDAGeek is reporting a rumor that the m100 will drop to just $100 in October.

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Public Relations Nightmare

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 8:45:20 AM #
If this is true, and if Sony does not offer an OS 4.x upgrade to the N710C, then Sony is going to have a public relations nightmare on its hands. No one is going to be pleased that they have to pay an additional $500 in order to listen to music, get 16 bit color, and get OS 4.x on their Clie's.

I don't think Sony would be that stupid, but who knows?

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 9:01:22 AM #
It won't happen that way, Sony may charge like $15-20 for it, but even then someone will take the ROM image from the new one and make it available on the underground. If Sony doesn't make an upgrade available, it will just cause normally honest people to try to find the illegal version instead of just the usual suspects.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 9:31:02 AM #
It is still to early to say whether Sony will or not. Handera still hasn't released the OS4 yet either, and it's dobutful that Sony would release it before the 760 comes out.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 9:50:08 AM #
Sony has had 4.x availble for the 610 for some time now, which is essentially the same hardware as the 710. There is no excuse that 4.0 is not available now. I'm starting to wonder if there isn't a hardware problem preventing the 710 from being upgradable, and that might be the reason for the new model. The other possibility is that they're making the OS on the 760 such that it can't be used on the 710, so you have to buy an upgrade.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 10:03:02 AM #
Sony would be stupid to not fulfill their earlier promise to make OS 4.x available for the 710C. I purchased a 710C 6 weeks ago (without knowing about a 760C) and I'm infuriated that Sony may go back on their earlier commitment to Palm OS 4.x on their 710C.
It's frustrating to see Sony keep screwing things up. It's like Sony doesn't care about an installed base and/or customer loyalty. Disappointing.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 10:21:25 AM #
Here it is - I own the M505 - which I like - fully realizing that it is not the best screen out there - it serves my need - no music etc. I am a professional that needs it for contacts scheduling remote mail etc.

I have not seen the sony handhelds - live in Canada - Sony does not realize that they have customers up here.

I am also the owner of Sony home theater equipment - Sony service is beyond terrible. I have had problems with some of my equipment - not a single reply to my continued requests. I was fortunate that I know the owner from where I purcahsed the equipment.

I certainly hope that the sony users that are without 4.x ge the upgrade they deserve - but i would not hold my breath - if you can return your product and wait for the new release on the new handheld.

Hopefully we will see sony handhelds in canada so that we have the selection. On that note, the new ppc system is looking damn interesting.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:06:51 AM #
I suppose Sony will announce the verdict on the upgrade soon. I think they did the right thing since no one would have bought the 710 if they had announced that there will be a new model coming out. Since they have stopped supplying the 710s, the announcement should be really very soon. :)

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:15:52 AM #
I don't think that Palm OS 4.0 upgrade is out for ANY handhelds yet. Both Handera and Sony has not release it yet... I don't think that Palm has even release the Palm OS 4.0 upgrade for their own Palm OS 3.5 handhelds yet.

I don't think that either Sony or HandEra is purposely sitting on the 4.0 upgrade. Palm may have an agreement with it's licensees that OS upgrade will not be available until a period of time that has past since new handhelds are shipped with a new OS. When the Palm OS 3.5 came out, the newer Palms had the OS for a while before the 3.5 upgrade was available.

It make sense from a marketing point of view, attract people to buy a new handheld with a new OS and then offer the upgrade to the users that did not want to buy a new handheld later.

So, I think that Sony and HandEra WANT to provide their customers with an upgrade, they just contractually cannot...yet.

my 0.02

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 12:13:59 PM #
The OS is available since the Sony 610C has it. Whether or not Sony can make it available as an upgrade is another issue. But why come out with a new model (760/770) with the new OS if that is the only difference between the new model and the 710C?

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 12:49:02 PM #
I am thinking that maybe Sony wanted to be the first one to offer all-in-one PDA with music, so they bypass OS 4 to come up with 710C. Therefore, I think the decision Sony's decision to come out with OS 3.5.2 PDA so that they can beat Palm m505 is purely a strategic move. They thought they can always offer an upgrade to OS4 and so they have the hardware ready. But it seems that this time it is taking to long for the development team to deal with OS4 with music. So why not come out with a new model with new OS and maybe a couple freebie software? I strongly believe they will come out with an upgrade, but how long is the wait I don't know.

RE: Public Relations Nightmare
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:20:59 PM #
>The OS is available since the Sony 610C has it.
>Whether or not Sony can make it available as an
>upgrade is another issue.

I think there's a difference between a NEW unit with OS 4.0 and an UPGRADE to 4.0. Look at them as two separate issues.

1. Palm installed OS 4.0 to it's m500 series before letting it's licensees have the it install on their NEW handheld. Sony with their Clie 610 and 320 and HandEra. The emphasis is on NEW handhelds.

2. Palm will probably release the Palm OS UPGRADE soon first for their own handhelds... the Vx and III series. Then Palm will probably allow its licensees have the UPGRADE.

So keep in mind, just because Sony or HandEra has handhelds with OS 4.0, it does not mean that they have or could legally release the OS 4.0 UPGRADE.

This is just speculation, but it could be part of their licensing agreement that Sony and HandEra COULD NOT release their OS upgrade until after Palm release theirs.

So don't get all bent worrying about rather or not Sony will release the OS 4.0 upgrade or not, especially if Palm or HandEra has released theirs yet.

Chill out!!

eVilla

mikecane @ 9/7/2001 10:15:19 AM #
Sony did the right thing for the (few) eVilla owners out there. Not only did they cancel the (bad) product, they told people they would buy them back -- and even arrange shipping! Have some faith, N710C owners!

RE: eVilla
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 1:01:12 PM #
Sony just did the same thing with their emarker ( http://www.emarker.com )

RE: eVilla
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 1:40:40 PM #
SONY is a company with a value proposition of "Product Innovation". That means they lead other companies like Palm in product design that exceeds the consumers expectations. In the case of the memory sticks and the 710C the price was $355 per 128MB because they just release this capacity as a new product and they weren't sure of the demand based upon sales history (mostly cameras used the memory stick). Look at the price after two months and its dropped to $119 for a 128MB stick. If the 760C is both a hardware and software upgrade, I would bet that they will recall all of the 710C, give you a 760C and perform the upgrade internally to control quality. Then sell them as refurbished 760C. The bottom line is that SONY will take care of you. History is your proof.

RE: eVilla
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 2:13:08 PM #
Boy, are you an optimist. You obviously have not had to deal with Sony's "customer support." It is not ver good. At best, Sony is likely to release an upgrade (it wouldn't surprise me if they charge for it as well). I spoke with someone at the support line a few minutes ago - he confirmed that the 710c has been discontinued and that a newer model will be released soon. As for the update, he gave me the standard answer "Sony is looking into it" and said that just because a product is discontinued, it does not mean that Sony won't support it with upgrades. Perhaps a hint of what he really knows but cannot divulge . . .

RE: eVilla
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 4:14:57 PM #
Yep, and guess what, you know the Sony eMarker? to "mark" radio stations or rather songs you hear on the radio station and stick it in the usb docking port, connect to the internet and they tell you the song? I received an email from them last week that they're stopping the service 9/30/2001, and guess what, they offered to pay me $25.00 if i mail them the emarker back to them by december. Cool, because i bought it for $19.99 ! w00h00 free $5.00 :)

RE: eVilla
mikecane @ 9/8/2001 4:10:15 AM #
One of the many people who can't be bothered to register (or is not bright enough to register) typed:

"Boy, are you an optimist. You obviously have not had to deal with Sony's "customer support.""

-- so what?! Sony's Customer Support is an open joke among all CLIE owners. Has been prior to the N710C. Didn't you read what they are doing for eVilla and eMarker owners? Or do you simply have an aneurysm that prevents you from retaining important information that contradicts your prejudices?

RE: eVilla
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/9/2001 1:15:57 AM #
I think everyone is forgetting about the cost. After the countless dollars spent reaserching, making a model, testing the model, and then finally releasing the model, that can cost big bucks!! I don't think anyone in there right mind would redo a whole line of handhelds so soon after they are released, just to redo the OS.

Any word on the encasement?

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 10:25:58 AM #
Honestly, I still like the all-metal case of my m505.

RE: Any word on the encasement?
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 1:28:47 PM #

The metal case was one of my favorite things about my m505. Perhaps dave.com will help rectify the situation with an aftermarket solution for the n710c...

Sony does it right on stock supply

wilco @ 9/7/2001 10:39:44 AM #
Unlike Palm, Sony is way better at inventory management. They sold off their supply of the N710c before announcing new products. That's the way to do it. Like Apple always do(You can tell new products like new Powerbooks are coming if the supply in the retail chain is getting low). Palm foul up big time with the m50x release, and is now suffering for it. Hope they learned their lesson.

As for OS upgrade, somewhere along the line, the upgrade will come. The question is how long. Besides, except for the increase in the number of colors the screen can display, there's not much more benefits. So really, it's no big deal.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:01:24 AM #
the one comfort i think we 710 owners have is that if sony doesnt release the update to OS 4.0, then they will never sell the lingering inventory of 710's.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:03:24 AM #
For me the increase in colors IS the reason for the upgrade. I have hundreds of digital pictures that I would like to keep on my handheld. I don't care what others seem to think, the jump from 8 bit color to 16 bit color will make a significant difference in the quality of the photos.

BTW, I am a Palm m505 user,I use SplashPhoto as my photo viewer, and I am quite pleased with the pictures on the m505, but I will seriously consider the 760C/770C if it actually ever comes out. Four times the resolution will be much better for pictures.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:03:42 AM #
Well, Sony can just take back the unsold 710s, upgrade the OS, change the packaging, and it's as good as the new one.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 11:10:14 AM #
I agree. If there's an OS 4.0 upgrade, no one will know that you have bought a 710. Good move on Sony not to put the model number on the casing. :)

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
LeshMan @ 9/7/2001 11:54:11 AM #
My wife has a 610, I have a 710 and I honestly cannot tell the different between the pictures in PGPocket.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 12:19:18 PM #
the pictures may only have 256 colors -- especially if you beamed them to her.

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 12:35:22 PM #
beamed to her?
filthy!

RE: Sony does it right on stock supply
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 1:28:09 PM #
As I recall there is a SPEED increase in 4.0, is there not? Go to Best Buy and navigate through the Datebook, Address, To Do List, and Memo Pad on a 610 and a 710 side by side and you can see how much faster the response is.


OS 4 upgrade.

choong @ 9/7/2001 1:49:00 PM #
This is becoming more infuriating by the second. Thye now have their hands on OS 4.1

What about those who took a chance on Sony still using 3.5.2? They really should release the upgrade as soon as possible.

I don't want to have to post another reply regarding how annoyed at the delay in the OS upgrade release.

Sony if you are reading, take heed, there ane thousands of customers such as myself who DEMAND the upgrade as a matter of course and as a duty to your customers.

Andrew.

RE: OS 4 upgrade.
rldunn @ 9/7/2001 2:16:53 PM #
> I don't want to have to post another reply regarding how annoyed at the delay in the OS upgrade release.

Good, because we don't want to read another post about this topic. Once you see other companies release their OS 4.0 upgrades and Sony doesn't, feel free to post away, but until then, quit repeating the same thing over and over and over every other day.

RE: OS 4 upgrade.
bradhaak @ 9/7/2001 8:59:04 PM #
Sorry, but if you use phrases like "take heed", it is impossible to take you seriously.

Beyond that, Sony is under no legal or moral obligation to release an OS upgrade. I have a N710C and hope that they do release it, but when you bought it there was no statement or commitment that it would ever be updated to newer OS versions. There is an implication of timely bug fixes, but a new OS version is not needed to fix any bugs that i am aware of...

RE: OS 4 upgrade.
mikecane @ 9/8/2001 4:13:44 AM #
Posted by: choong @ 9/7/2001 1:49:00 PM

This is becoming more infuriating by the second. Thye now have their hands on OS 4.1

What about those who took a chance on Sony still using 3.5.2? They really should release the upgrade as soon as possible.

=========

Haven't you been getting any value out of the CLIE so far?! You sound as if the wool has been pulled over your eyes. Prior to the N770C announcement, you were probably lording it over m505 owners and pleased as all hell to have your N710C. You should still be pleased.

New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 2:17:50 PM #
Well, I just preordered a "SONY Clie COLOUR" on http://www.sonystyle.co.uk - they will ship them after the announcement on September 20. No mention on the particulars we all talk about (OS version, # colours):

399.00 GBP incl. VAT

Pre-Order NOW and get two free original Sony Style CLIÉ covers!
The eagerly-awaited Sony Colour CLIÉ Handheld (Communication, Link, Information and Entertainment) will soon be within your reach - its release for The United Kingdom at Sony Style is scheduled for approximately 20 September 2001.

The Sony Style team takes this opportunity to offer you, as its privileged customer, the chance to pre-order the Sony Colour CLIÉ from 3 September 2001 till 19 September 2001! It will be shipped to you, without any shipping charges on the first day it becomes available in the United Kingdom. You will also receive as a special present from Sony Style, two stylish covers for your CLIÉ - in white and silver.
[...]

Ofcourse - this is European news ;-)


RE: New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.
bradhaak @ 9/7/2001 3:24:51 PM #
interestingly, nowhere on this site (that i could find) do they mention OS version or the number of colors.

RE: New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 4:01:26 PM #
SO, who will call them and ask about the OS version? :-)

RE: New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2001 6:59:14 PM #
Its so funny how they phrase it. The spec page says "Operating System: The latest Palm OS version". There is definetely no mention of how many colors.

RE: New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/8/2001 7:00:29 AM #
I called the SonyStyle UK number yesterday and on the 10th attempt I got through and they couldn't tell me anything about the model number or the OS version :O(

RE: New SONY Clie COLOUR preorder on sonystyle.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/8/2001 9:05:09 AM #
I wonder whether it was premature to order it as I don't want 256 cols/OS 3.5, but if a 16-bit OS 4.0 European colour model is to be announced towards the end of September and sonystyle.co.uk starts to ship this "mystery model" on September 20 - it almost have to be the new one.

I guess I can return it if it turns out to be the old model...


Palm OS 4.1

Ia3n @ 9/7/2001 7:15:52 PM #
What is Palm OS 4.1?

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